It was one of your previous articles about this subject I got off my meds. I was mild, at least my Dr. said so.

I believe it was the article about getting insurance when you have one of those meds in your "List -o-stuff-I-currently-take".

I was not ready for the withdrawals. My "body trying to craw out of my skin" is about the only way I can explain it. However, with prayer, and the realization that I had not fully grieved for a life lost, I am much better.

The life lost was my own. This happens when a tragic thing comes along and the life you envisioned, two, five, twenty years down the road is gone. Poof, blown the heck away. This line is closed, new life is in that line over there.

Thank you for your help even when you don't know you are doing it.

Are you taking the generic form? If not, it's cheaper.

Not as an expert, but as someone who has taken depression meds, I can empathize on a certain level. It is always better to start taking them and stop taking them gradually changing the doze - I used to bite parts of my pill off. The best things that helped was a lot of time spent in prayer and going to confession. One of my spiritual fathers told me that God can heal us in an instant, but we still need to cooperate - break down the walls that separate us from God, in Whom is our life. I wish you all the best.

I understand - been there, done that...
My husband and I Both take anti-depressants (which thankfully because of a benefirt scheme in Australia only cost us $5 each a month) and at times have tested living without them. However, we have an iron-clad promise to each other that if we notice significant changes when off them, we will listen to what the other one says is happening. Listen to Jeanene - she knows you best.

Here's hoping you can live well without them now.
Cheers - Janet McKinney

I weaned myself off paxil over a year ago. The withdrawl symptoms for that one are pretty bad because of the short serum half-life, but after a month I was done and not feeling too electro-shocky.

I'm doing better than I have for the past 10 years or so. Maybe the meds helped me enough so I could learn to handle the symptoms better before they spiral out of control.

I hate to use the word, but it felt incredibly liberating to be off the meds.

I like the idea of listening to Jeanene. She'll be able to see things you can't (or won't).

I was on Effexor for four years, and it eliminated my libido. I mean...gone. The doc switched me to Paxil (was taking Wellbutrin along with both) but it didn't help matters. B.B. King put it so well..."the thril is gone."

I know what you mean about the anger thing, but that ugly sob can bite you in the butt very quickly. PLEASE listen to Jeanene. The last thing you'd want to happen is have your temper damage your relationship with your children or her. And it can happen. Trust me.

You're not the first person I've heard talk about going off their depression meds and discovering how flat their feelings had been. It seems to be a really common thing with depression meds, you no longer get the sads, but you also no longer get the happies. Everything is just ... flat.

Good luck!!

In hopes that this is helpful to you -- I've recently been able to decrease my Wellbutrin SR dosage by 50% (from the maximum dose of 300 mg/day down to 150 mg/day). So far it's been successful (two months on the lower dose without feeling suicidal), and I think that two of the biggest contributors to my doing okay on the lower dose are fish oil and an iron supplement. The fish oil helps boost omega-3 levels, which are badly out of whack in the average American diet, and the iron helps me avoid a bone-deep fatigue that my brain interprets as being depression-caused lack of energy (and from that interpretation it's a quick slide into wishing I could just lie down and die).

Other non-medical things that might help: I've also been reading about how low levels of vitamin D can contribute to fatigue and depression-like symptoms; sure enough, after getting tested last week, my levels are very low. Haven't started supplementing the D, though, so I have no first-hand experience of its effect on the depression symptoms.

Very best wishes to you from another struggler with this rotten disease.

My father recently told me that he had been "off the meds" for a dozen months or so and said it was the best thing he ever did. I know it's arguable but he says that the TALK THERAPY was incredibly helpful. I guess they equipped him with "tools" to use when the depression sneaks back. I realize that there are some misfiring synapses or chemical imbalances and what have you. But, he is really a big fan of that therapy and not the drugs.

If I were a betting man, I'd bet that the anger isn't about the dice rolling off the table: that's just a release trigger for the anger caused by the uncontrollable situation in re: the meds. But then, I've never taken anti-depressants, so I may well be blowing smoke and you should shift in your chair to keep the target moving.

Vicarious anger exists, though, and I feel some of it. I'm angry that the meds your doctor prescribed cost 2.5 times as much at Walgreens as on the 'net. I'm angry that Humana could make the same clerical errors over and over in your daughter's case.

I'm less angry that none of the free market advocates have bothered to show up to explain. Maybe they're all busy informing their Congressional representatives that they don't want bureaucrats rationing their health care...

An employment-related group policy covers my health, and costs me a little over a hundred bucks a month - about what we spend for my wife's Medicare coverage. I'm angry that your coverage can't approach ours; don't you, as a real, live, preacher have access to any group coverage? (Maybe there's an opportunity there for ecumenical insurance-pool creation there) Or do you have to just hope y'all survive long enough to qualify for Medicare?

I am taking meds myself and whoo boy and I no good off of them. I was out of my meds for about 2 weeks and just started back up about 5 days ago. Those 2 weeks were hell. I have awful mood swings and anxiety without my meds. My doctor recently upped my dosage (at my request) and thankfully the new strength is covered by Wal-Mart's $4 plan!! Thank God! Being on my meds don't make me feel flat like so many report... it just makes me feel normal. Happy, sad, angry... but not out of control sadness or anger. Luckily we don't have any kids, so the only one who gets to see crazy (off her meds) Mary Jo is my husband.

God bless you, Gordon. For your honesty, for your transparency, for your courage.

Take a good B vitamin complex. Since I went off my meds over a year ago, I can tell a huge difference on the days when I take vitamins and when I don't. Not the 'on my meds/off my meds' difference, but a more basic baseline energy, which helps keep me from depression.

Godspeed.

God bless you, Gordon. For your honesty, for your transparency, for your courage.

Take a good B vitamin complex. Since I went off my meds over a year ago, I can tell a huge difference on the days when I take vitamins and when I don't. Not the 'on my meds/off my meds' difference, but a more basic baseline energy, which helps keep me from depression.

Godspeed.

For various reasons I had to change psychiatrists and the new one I was assigned to was all, "Sure, it's about time you came off the medication, no problems." without any warnings of possible ramifications, like going back to the same dosage of the same medication may not be effective any more.

Came off (Effexor) very gradually, and was fine for about three months, but it was slowly creeping up on me. Went to the GP and got a referral to another psychiatrist because I didn't want to go back to the other guy (who I later found out through others in the profession is, well, let's say not held in high regard).

I felt better after I had done that and didn't make the appointment, and again, it slowly crept up on me until I reached the "OH SHIT I'M IN TROUBLE" wall. All credit to my GP who saw me daily for five days straight (over a weekend, no less) and my wife who managed whatever medications and exercises he threw at me to keep me calm for the next few weeks until the longer-term solution medications started to have effect again. There are two weeks there that I don't remember very much of except for one morning when I sat in the bottom of the wardrobe and measured some cord because I "just wanted to know" if it was long enough to hang myself with.

It took most of a year to recover from this debacle, including having to take a 30% higher dosage then I was on before to have the same effect. Needless to say I'm not planning on trying the no medication route again any time soon.

I'm not saying you shouldn't try it, although not doing it in consultation with a doctor alarms me a bit^*, and stopping cold turkey is a really bad idea (although it sounds like that was beyond your control in this case). We all have to deal with this crap in whatever way works best for us. I have one friend who does manage her depression without medication, but sometimes (as in my case) that's not an option.

^* OTOH, I have no idea what the general doctors are like in your country, especially when it comes to mental health issues.

I guess I just wanted to give a cautionary tale of my experience in the last few years with this. Keep on top of it, don't let it get on top of you, I guess. Stay safe.

Peace & chocolate.

E.

I was on Lexapro since 2003 (and Paxil from 1999 until 2001). A few months ago I decided to see how well I do without the meds. So far, so good. Sometimes I have anxiety or feel depressed, but I can usually trace the feelings to an errant, unhealthy thought pattern or a specific event. I was in talk therapy for 10 years, and that helped me become self-aware enough to use the tools I learned in therapy. But like you, I have a partner who is keeping an eye on me, and I have a full refill ready, in case I need to go back on it. So far, though, I think I've finally gotten to the place where I don't need them, and I am very happy about that. Not that I was rushing myself to get off the meds; I am simply grateful that I have healed enough for my brain chemistry to be self-regulating, at least for now.

I can relate to your dilemma. I am a pastor who is currently without a call to a congregation which means that there is no one to pay my health insurance benefits which they normally would do. For us to pay for them would be $1100/mo. So, we are attempting to apply for other insurance through the state for people who are high-risk and otherwise uninsurable because of pre-existing conditions. That will cost us half as much. It will be a $1000 deductible, so once we hit that, it will be better. But, I only make $1800/mo.

In the meantime I had to buy my Effexor and Wellbutrin (generic) refills last week. With a discount card the two prescriptions added up to $242. Without the discount it would have been $75 more. I have one other prescription I take for my thyroid which will also be rather spendy. That $242 is more than 1/3 of one paycheck for me!

I've been on antidepressants since 2000. I've tried going off at least twice, and didn't do very well at all. The withdrawal from Effexor is TERRIBLE! OK. Let me say it again: terrible, horrible, absolutely awful!! I haven't tried that again since 2005, and I'm not sure that I will.

I agree with the person's comments about vitamins and minerals. I take fish oil, vitamin b12, calcium, vitamin c, iron, etc. I think they really help, even when I'm on the meds.

As one who kicked the Effexor to the curb a few years ago cold turkey I can empathize that it is hard. But soon you will start to feel your thinking become more ordered and your reactions less trigger happy.

A person above mentioned Fish Oil, I can not more hihgly recommend that. I take a regular dose of it and it does help with the head, among other things. It is cheap as well. I have a member of my congregation that was schezophrenic and he does large doses of fish oil and is completely off his medication and doing just fine. That might be a tad drastic, but the principle is there.

Stay accountable to your wife and if she says you are off your rocker, trust her. She knows you better then any earthly person does and lean into her advise.

Hang in there bud. As you have prayed for me, I am praying for you!

~Carl Holmes~

Gordon,
Thank you for your candor and honesty.
Just be carefull.
I have been on this rollercoaster, and have seen many of my loved ones on it as well.
I think every one on antidepresents experiences it. In fact my doctor says it is to be expected.

You take your meds, you feel better. You convince yourself you don't need your meds, and you go off...

Eventually, you realize you really need your meeds, but by then, your life is hell again, and you have hurt the people you love.

Jeanene may not notice the changes for quite sometime, because they are subtle, and she really wants to believe you can live without meds.

Check in with her often, and ask her to be honest.

I pray that you will do well, and believe that some people do...

I also know many do not.

Praying for you.

Bob

Thanks for posting this, Gordon. Just one more example of how badly we need to improve our health care system in this country.

On the anger bit, I heard something from Nebraska football coach Bo Pelini that has changed my parenting for the better. He talked about a time when he watched one of his assistants go completely nuclear on a player for making a mistake. He let it happen, then took the assistant off to the side and said, "You realize losing your temper was all about you, right? You might feel better, but it didn't teach that player any better than just correcting the problem."

Ever since hearing this I've realized the same is true for me dealing with our two girls. Of course, since we're human, we'll want to lose our temper, just like you said, and when we do, we feel terrible about it. But for me, realizing that "losing your temper was all about you" has helped me be a calmer, better father.

For what it's worth, anyway. You're light years ahead of me in this department, so don't think I'm criticizing your parenting - if I'm where you're at when our girls are teenagers I'll consider myself pretty fortunate.

Grace & peace,
Scott

Dietrich Bonhoeffer: "It is only by living completely in this world that one learns to believe. One must abandon every attempt to make something of oneself, whether it be a saint, a converted sinner, a churchman, a righteous man, or an unrighteous one...

....from someone who's been there and prays never to be there again. You are in my prayers. (from MN Lutheran)

I went off Wellbutrin almost exactly that way about 12 years ago. It worked out fine -- so that's one data point.

I too, love the idea of you listening to Jeanene.

What can you do-what helped my wife dealing with depression and trying to stay off meds? Of course, nothing that I'm about to mention is THE answer, or even a decent alternative to medication. But I tend to think that attention to things certainly helps.

Cognitive behavioral therapy - search online for some books and reviews.

Regular exercise seriously needs a mention here. Now understand that I'm an orthopedic physical therapist, so exercise is one of my "hammers" for hitting every nail. Routine exercise absolutely makes a huge difference for my wife. She has to schedule it in, like a doctors appt. Sometimes she hates keeping it as an obligation. But it's so worth it.

I mean, seriously Gordon, you could write eloquently on this. See how much you care about the dice after you've just finished pushing your entire physical capacity. Start slowly but build up to the point where you push yourself a little on whatever activity you can (mentally and physically) tolerate.

Anger happens. Though that doesn't make it right. I'm a generally happy and calm guy, but sometimes I push too hard to accomplish too much in too little time, and find myself plain tired and angry and barking at my kids over nothing - no fault but my own. I'm not suggestion that your anger is always your own fault; just to give attention to the big picture beyond meds and the actual moment of being angry.

Doesn't everyone struggle when they sit around too much and do too little - and - when they push too hard and try to "accomplish" too much? Folks with chemical imbalance are more sensitive to this.

-Bob G

Powerful writing, RLP...thanks much for the read. If you're just sick of hearing about this whole medication thing, skip down to "Blessings." :)

A few quick thoughts that I hope may be of some help to you: I know you don't want to ask your doctor if it's okay, as it were, and that sounds all right to me, but it might be helpful to make sure s/he knows about it anyway. That way, if things do start to go down the tubes again (and I dearly hope this does NOT happen,) your doc will know it might be because you're off your meds and not because the meds don't cut it anymore, and therefore won't try to change your prescription altogether. This is especially true if the next-step drug is nastier in terms of side effects.

Also, if you haven't, you might want to take a quick look around and make sure that stopping for a while doesn't weaken the drug's effects on you if you take it again later. Depression isn't exactly like a bacterium that can pick up drug resistance, but you are dealing with brain chemistry and I don't know if we understand that very well.

Blessings.

Folks have given some good suggestions for nuttritional supplements. I'd like to add one more - 5-HTP. It's a building block of seratonin, and I took it twice a day before I finally bit the bullet and decided I needed to go on an antidepressant. It does take the edge off the mood swings. Finally, please go back on the meds if you feel yourself sliding. Don't wait until you are in a crisis.

I felt the need to say something in light of all the concerns; those expressed and otherwise...

Gordon is doing well. We are both observant, and I think we are humble enough to know when a situation begins to get the best of us. (That's one of those lessons we learned the hard way.)

Your prayers and good wishes for us are appreciated. Sincerely appreciated. Thank you for your expressions of love and concern.

I am always mindful in our struggles that so many others share a similar path, or worse. Please, as you pray for us, pray too for so many who are completely unable to get the medical care they need. Pray that SOME significant health care reform would be born of a careful, ethical and just process.

Gratefully-
Jeanene

to keep of the meds.

make sure you are eating well, resting plenty and playing hard. If you have trouble sleeping then just pop a few Benadryl! Get a good routine and don't stay up too late.

sincerely, good luck.

I've relatively recently cut my anti-depressant dose in half, went through a bumpy patch and have stabilized at a point where the balance of the increased amplitude of highs and lows is worth it. I'd recommend trying a staggered withdrawal.

The "terrible" NHS means I (or anyone other UKian) stump up a Prescription Charge every two months of £7.20 ($11.87), no matter what the drug.

Why does Big Pharma rip you off? Because you (plural; "y'all"?) let them. The interesting question is why do y'all do that?

(Socialism is crap, but that doesn't mean wide-open, free market Capitalism is entirely wonderful.)

The US is not, in fact, in any danger of experiencing "wide-open, free market Capitalism". The world is divided into individual markets along largely State lines and each of these artificially created smaller markets is then milked to maximize profits. $600 in US, $250 in CA, and $50 in Africa - all for the exact same product.

Of course, as a rational participant in the US market, you may determine it's in your best interests to purchase from one of the cheaper markets. And it is, in fact, in your best interests. But that impacts Profits. Consequently, Big Pharma is pushing for tougher and tougher legal barriers and consequences for your behavior.

On the one hand, they talk about "free markets" and "globalization" as the great equalizers - but they only mean that on the manufacturing side, on the expenses side of their balance sheet. Should you attempt to engage in the same behaviors they do (outsourcing, importing, etc.), that affects the income side of their balance sheet and that is CLEARLY unacceptable, un-American, harmful to the economy, bad for us in ways we're all too dim to understand, blah blah blah.

Dividing up the world economy into individual markets to benefit only businesses and not consumers is a big BS sandwich. They argue for their freedom to manufacture it in Mexico but want to deny you the freedom to purchase it from Mexico through political means. I do not understand how so many Americans walk around believing this is actually in their best interests and support these people by calling them "Free Marketers", which they most definitely are not. They are Selective Protectionists supporting economic and political protections for themselves but not the rest of us.

It's seriously frustrating that the vast majority of business and economics reporters don't do anything like presenting a balanced view of this issue in 98%+ of the articles I've read in the last 10 years.

A pastor from a long time ago called his undiagnosed depression a "big black dog". I have bi-polar disorder (a friend from Australia called it bi-polarism--I like that better.) Some days I walk that big black dog, other days he walks me.

A far as meds, talk to your doctor. Drug companies give huge amounts of medications to give out as samples.